Should lumberjack job be buffed?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by coolerjam, Dec 5, 2018.

  1. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    Hello i would like to make a discussion about lumberjack job.As quick glance at the /j info of lumberjack and digger,you can tell that lumberjacks make as twice as much as diggers.But in reality,we all know that Diggers make alot more than Lumberjacks due to their sand/glass selling.
    "We can't just boost jobs randomly due to players's feelings" "provide me the exact amount of numbers/maths" "How much % should i boost the job? 5%,10%,50%..." "We aiming for 260k an hour of lv 75 of every jobs without boosters" - i quoted Naskel
    So i am here needing your opinions about this. Firstly i will go with the buff choice:
    1.Jobs earnings: I would like to ask diggers and lumberjacks to comment on here what levels are they,how much do they make exactly in one hour of grinding in /j earnings (One hour of working non stop is preferred since i know people do grind jobs but in that one hour,they may have some chat and do other minor stuffs).
    2.Produces: Then please tell us how many produces do you made in that one hour? (Ex: How many logs can Lumberjacks get in one hour,how many stack of sand can diggers get.)
    3.How much and how frequently can you sell your produces? (Ex: Glasses are usually go for around 10-12k per inventory - 2304 in normal time in Medieval.I don't know much about logs price so if you can,please let me know). This is the most crucial point because in Medieval,i can see 3 auctions of an inventory of glasses a day at the price of 12k but for logs,it takes more than a week for someone to auct an inventory of logs and worse,i saw an auction of an inventory of logs went without a winner even thought they were free!
    After receiving your datas,i will make a full database about the 2 jobs and then we can discuss of how much % should lumberjack be buffed.
    One small note: there is not even a single lv 75 lumberjack in Medieval and there are only 2 in Atlantis :D. So besides all the incomes and profits,the job should be buffed in order for more people to join it otherwise,the "all jobs are balanced" claim is a completely fall.If all jobs are balanced then explain why there are 15 lv 75 hunters but not a single lumberjack.
    Second option is no need to buff lumberjack. You're welcomed to give opinions on no buff too.Please let us know why do you think no need for a buff.

    I'm currently lv 75 alchemist and 69 cook,i have done many testings of one hour grinding - no chat.no talk,grind one hour straight and i can make average 350k an hour with alchemist by brewing with only golden apples, which is above the target of 260k an hour since golden apples are hard to get - make sense right? While for cook,i can only make ~250k an hour with cooking potatoes and crafting breads - i have 45 furnaces and i think it's a decent amount of furnaces cooks should have.Without crafting breads,i only make about 50k.You may notice that i c an make the same amount of 350k when i level my cook to lv 75 but here is the case,i have macro for cook and as i said "only golden apples".So yeah people without macro will have a hard time for cook job and not to mention if i use other ingredients like sulphurs,dragon breaths,my income of alchemist will go to 500k an hour! Easy 250k compared to 350k of hard working because i can afk with cook while alchemist don't
     
    #1 coolerjam, Dec 5, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2018
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  2. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    Terrible sorry for multiple editing!The post is fully completed now
     
  3. GJR_2003

    GJR_2003 Staff
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    Wait, is there a 2nd person lvl 75? :eek:
    Didnt know that.
    I'd personally agree lumberjack needs a buff
     
  4. PInkFloyd

    PInkFloyd Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, lumberjack seems like such a fun job, not to mention it would finally make 2/3 of the resource world useful. It’s also so sad when someone joins and says “what job should I join” they of course get the response of “whatever you like best!” And then they say lumberjack and get a big disappointment
     
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  5. JackJanson

    JackJanson New Member

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    Well the way I look at jobs, is supply and demand, How much an I supply and what sort of demand is there.

    I don't even know what type of demand is out there for Logs... on any server.

    I always see Lumberjack as an early game occupation
     
  6. BlackBriarMead

    BlackBriarMead Well-Known Member

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    as far as alchemist goes, I would like to say I don't know how crafting water bottles, putting them in the stands, and taking them our affects the earnings rate - since I do things in bulk I really don't know what the average earnings for alchemist is in the long run
     
  7. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    It's been a week and still no one comment. RIP
     
  8. TheStrongestOne

    TheStrongestOne Well-Known Member

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    I'm going to work up some numbers but I haven't had the time yet
     
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  9. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    Thanks! I'm really looking forward to you!
     
  10. Lyvaella

    Lyvaella New Member

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    I will do the test for you soon. I think it's great to see someone trying to help balance the system. At the same time, my attitude towards jobs is different. I grind a job in real life so I refuse to grind one in a game. I simply play Minecraft and take jobs that fit what I enjoy, resource gathering. If I make money while I'm doing what I would be doing anyway, awesome sauce. However, I know a lot of players are focused on making money and working jobs. I don't rely on jobs to make money. If sand/glass is in demand and getting good pay, I sell it. If someone needs terracotta, I sell it. I agree with the comment earlier about supply and demand. My biggest frustration is not that the jobs are unbalanced. It is that the market fluctuates too drastically. If I were to change something, it would be to have a default shop players can sell to all the time. Make the prices lower than average so players are encouraged to sell to other players first, but have it as an option so new players can sell that stupid sugar cane they have by the bundles. Just my personal opinion, nothing more.
     
  11. TheStrongestOne

    TheStrongestOne Well-Known Member

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    Results
    I've done 2 hours of woodcutting to get an average number, though results would have been better if I had done it for more hours.
    Started at 16:40 (Server Time) and ended at 18:40 (Server Time)

    The Setup:
    I decided to continue chopping down the jungle biome I have access to instead of a tree farm. Tree farm would have been more efficient, since natural terrain takes much more time to navigate than a tree farm.
    I set a home at the edge of a pack of trees, and place down storage chests.

    Chests are Empty.
    MCMMO
    Woodcutting level is at 400 (26.67% for double log drops)
    Lumberjack Job
    at lv 35 at approx. 0 XP (according to /jobsgui : 2.50$/1.97xp)


    Gear:
    [​IMG]
    My Trusty Diamond Axe: Betsy 2.0. I also have the Haste 2 Buff active from the Miner Job.
    Honorable mention to Feather Falling gear, in case something goes wrong.

    Method:
    Cut down smaller trees from the ground, pillar with cut logs if needed.
    For the 2x2 jungle trees, I climb them manually and cut them from above.
    MCMMO Woodcutting grants the ability Leaf Blower, allowing me to quickly remove leaves (which does affect the durability usage of the axe).
    Activate Tree Feller whenever it's possible. Unfortunately it almost never works because the jungle trees are too connected, making them too large for Tree Feller to actually work.


    Results:

    - 6327 Jungle Logs
    - 206 Oak Logs
    - 30 Apples
    - 128 Cocoa Beans
    - Jungle Saplings and Oak Saplings (3 Stacks / 3 Stacks)
    - 10,102.00 $
    -
    8227 Job XP
    - 15 MCMMO Woodcutting Levels


    Was this the most efficient way for me to do this?
    Absolutely not. If I had access to /top, from the Builder Job, I would have made much more.
    And even then, Jungle Biomes are arguably the most annoying terrains to navigate.
    Around the 80 minutes mark, I also had to spend 5 minutes at the /t spawn farm Cave Spider XP farm to fully repair my axe.

    Suggestions I have:
    While I don't want to give a suggestion concerning the XP and money rate, as to be honest I haven't been on the server long enough to know how much the money is actually worth my time, I do have another suggestion.
    All the servers are slowly but surely updating to 1.13. Update Aquatic.
    This update added a recipe that renders one Lumberjack Perk obsolete. The Level 50 Perk of being able to Silk Touch 6-sided bark logs is useless in 1.13, since there is a recipe for 6-sided logs added in that update.
    My suggestion? LETS MAKE A NEW PERK TO REPLACE IT HECK YEAH!
    What about this?
    [​IMG]
    Lets give our dear Lumberjacks their own Custom Recipe!
    I suggest we replace the ''Silk Touch 6-sided Bark'' with the ability to use charcoal to craft coal blocks!
    This will put charcoal on the same level of usability as Coal, giving Lumberjacks the option to process their wood into a product they can sell.


    I hope this has been useful for you, @coolerjam :p
     
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  12. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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  13. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    And i just got informations from a friend of @reddevil22,she's a lv 75 digger
    She got 122,410$ in /j earnings,7.5 dub chests of sand and 330,525$ from selling Wither Skulls,Ghast Tears and stuffs
     
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  14. TheStrongestOne

    TheStrongestOne Well-Known Member

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    I think I forgot to mention that using Tree Feller doesn't give you Job XP and Money for the entire tree, but for the first log you cut instead. I believe this also has effect on the xp and money rates
     
  15. Basher515

    Basher515 Well-Known Member
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    Reposting since it got deleted..

    I am currently the top 2 lumberjack in the classic server. The biggest problem about lumberjack is that logs aren't that much of a commodity. Unlike farmers and miners and diggers who can sell their items to cooks, blacksmiths, and builders, logs is not part of the "job community". It's just used for building for everyone without any financial benefits. That is why the value of logs fluctuate, from absolutely free to over 500+ per stack (Currently at 400 on market).

    That's why my main suggestion alongside others is for lumberjacks to be able to join this community by being able to craft coal blocks out of charcoal. While a lot cheaper than wheat/potatoes, ores, and glass, coal blocks caters all types of jobs which is always in demand. This extra income will definitely increase the popularity of the lumberjack job.

    With that said, the "regular" income from chopping down log is another matter entirely. Here is my statistics, but do note that I operate an industrial spruce farm which greatly skews the results, compared to normal lumberjacks. This shows how a high-efficiency lumberjack could make, and does not represent normal lumberjacks who has a typical tree farm spaced evenly among trees and had to clear out leaves, climb it, chop down the log, and run towards the next tree.

    Axe stats:
    [​IMG]

    Player stats:
    McMMO Woodcutting lvl: 1446
    (Double Drop Chance 96.40%)
    Lumberjack lvl: 62 (98539.63xp before 1hr session)
    $ per Spruce Log: $7.22
    XP per Spruce Log: 5.69XP


    1 hr session statistics:
    Total logs: 18,624 (5 double chests + 21 stacks)
    Total XP: 98,375.07
    Earnings:
    $124,876.15

    Does this information help? Though, I would really wish that the coal block idea is to be implemented.
     
    #15 Basher515, Jan 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
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  16. coolerjam

    coolerjam Active Member
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    Please provide the axe you're using
     
  17. Basher515

    Basher515 Well-Known Member
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    Edited my post.
     
  18. _TheOrangeJuice_

    _TheOrangeJuice_ Well-Known Member
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    That is actually not far off the actual target payout of $150,000 per hour. All jobs are normalised to (hopefully) pay out $150,000 per hour at level 60, for someone working continuously. Lumberjack is not as bad as it seems.
     
  19. GJR_2003

    GJR_2003 Staff
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    That's at lvl 75 ;)
     
  20. Basher515

    Basher515 Well-Known Member
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    The thing is - my sample is a very large spruce tree farm. To get the expected $150,000 per hour, do you expect ALL lumberjacks to create a massive and complicated spruce tree farm? Note that this farm is redstone-based, and not just a huge plot of land that makes it easy to harvest logs. Frankly, I'm pretty sure I'm not supposed to build something this big, though in my experience it's not really causing a lot of lag. Here's a screenshot on how big the farm is when I gathered my data (I upgraded the farm)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Not only that, every other "Gatherer" job can sell their items which are in demand, like Sand, or Ores that can exceed that $150k you mentioned. Cooler just made a post to compare a lumberjack to a digger. While I did earn a lot more based on /j earnings, selling the sand/glass off more than doubles what I earn in a single hour.
     
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